This serves all the A-20 kits but especially the A-20B with the flight controls
and the A-20G-1 with the upper rear gunner but no flight controls:
and the A-20G-1 with the upper rear gunner but no flight controls:
-
Modelers Alliance has updated the forum software on our website. We have migrated all post, content and user accounts but we could not migrate the passwords.
This requires that you manually reset your password.
Please click here, http://modelersalliance.org/forums/login to go to logon page and use the "Forgot your Password" option.
Wreaking Havoc 1: A-20B 41-3266(?) Outhouse Mouse with a Sharkmouth
- Thread starter Sharkmouth
- Start date
This post is repeated on the A-20G-1-DO thread. Photos to follow but some work was done on the engine cowlings for both the A-20B and A-20-G-1-DO as they are the same. This meant adding five (5) exhaust ejector pipes on the outer upper fixed flap (see A-20G-1-DO tech manual image below whose engine cowl cover would the be same), four (4) exhaust ejector pipes on the inner fixed flap, and five more, tom complete fourteen (14), underneath the stamp shaped movable flaps on the lower side:
Still better than Paul Budzik who has to smooth out the cowl flaps as the A-20A he's building had a collector ring with a single eject on the outboard side of each nacelle. The open cooling vents were a temporary measure which were deleted later during production:
Still better than Paul Budzik who has to smooth out the cowl flaps as the A-20A he's building had a collector ring with a single eject on the outboard side of each nacelle. The open cooling vents were a temporary measure which were deleted later during production:
Sheesh, need to remove the horizontal frame from the common windscreen in all the kits... It shouldn't be there for any Havoc produced prior to the DB-7B/A-20C:
Time to point out detail bits for any modeler working on the Havoc.
This is the wingtip from the start of the A-20G-1-DO to about the A-20G-30-DO (I may correct this range later). Note that the teardrop shaped bulb is the navigation light while the bulb in the clear aft half of the wingtip is a formation light. It should not be green/red.
Compare to full clear wingtip incorporating both starting with the A-20G-30-DO (this one is serial 43-9716 from the 647th Bomb Squadron, 413th Bombardment Group, 9th AF, after a hard landing in England on the 28th of May,1944):
Clear sections of the wingtip are not on this A-20B. I will simply fill in the outline for the clear section:
This is the wingtip from the start of the A-20G-1-DO to about the A-20G-30-DO (I may correct this range later). Note that the teardrop shaped bulb is the navigation light while the bulb in the clear aft half of the wingtip is a formation light. It should not be green/red.
Compare to full clear wingtip incorporating both starting with the A-20G-30-DO (this one is serial 43-9716 from the 647th Bomb Squadron, 413th Bombardment Group, 9th AF, after a hard landing in England on the 28th of May,1944):
Clear sections of the wingtip are not on this A-20B. I will simply fill in the outline for the clear section:
Someone, on another forum where I am sharing my TMI (since they are building in 32nd scale where it is all visible), stated that "...some early airframes were converted to the later style (likely during engine changes later in the war), so check your references for your particular bird:"
I've never seen this but did find an image which could lead someone to believe that. This 'looks' like an A-20C with much later engines.
However, the serial number (43-21751) exposes its identity. This is the sole CA-20J attached to Air Transport Command (see badge on tail cone after the national insignia and below the serial. The is was made by stripping the last A-20J-25-DO made and swapping the nose (or perhaps it is what was available) of an A-20C. The 'C' designated cargo. So, if I weren't so stubborn about my 'sharkmouth' restrictions, I could get another A-20G kit to use the nose on Amorous Amazon and attach the spare A-20C nose (not used for Outhouse Mouse or Amorous Amazon) and create this! ATC decals and yellow serials are readily available!
I've never seen this but did find an image which could lead someone to believe that. This 'looks' like an A-20C with much later engines.
However, the serial number (43-21751) exposes its identity. This is the sole CA-20J attached to Air Transport Command (see badge on tail cone after the national insignia and below the serial. The is was made by stripping the last A-20J-25-DO made and swapping the nose (or perhaps it is what was available) of an A-20C. The 'C' designated cargo. So, if I weren't so stubborn about my 'sharkmouth' restrictions, I could get another A-20G kit to use the nose on Amorous Amazon and attach the spare A-20C nose (not used for Outhouse Mouse or Amorous Amazon) and create this! ATC decals and yellow serials are readily available!
Yay! Kit doesn't have the braces... Wait, that means I need to add them to every other subject!
Some more images. I haven't found these nacelle guns on any photographs of the A-20G-1-DO although a document stated that the first 250 would be so equipped. However, only 248 A-20G-1-DO were built and none of the manuals mention nacelle guns. Only Outhouse Mouse will get the modification.
Reference images to help location:
I am thinking about doing a tutorial on squash casting (not squash forming as that is for clear pieces). It can be used for nuts/bolts/rivets and casting marks but I will be using it to make navigation/position/recognition lights/beacons. This was reinforced after seeing the prices on Aires 4300 48th scale Position Lights & Anti-Collision Beacons. WOW!
Anyway, I know I may have some plastic (Someone in Eastern Europe, possibly PlusModel) actually offered them in low pressure molded styrene plastic. A drop of future and they were not only perfectly clear but attached to the kit via the stalk which one pushed into the drilled hole on the kit.
I found the same item under another name from an evilBay estate sale and made a ridiculous offer:
Let's see what happens. In any case, itis good to do the tutorial (I had planned it for my P-40 series over a decade ago) as you can use it to replace a solid opaque recognition/position/navigation light/beacon with a proper clear one. I still buy toothbrushes based on them being in clear colors I can use!
Anyway, I know I may have some plastic (Someone in Eastern Europe, possibly PlusModel) actually offered them in low pressure molded styrene plastic. A drop of future and they were not only perfectly clear but attached to the kit via the stalk which one pushed into the drilled hole on the kit.
I found the same item under another name from an evilBay estate sale and made a ridiculous offer:
Let's see what happens. In any case, itis good to do the tutorial (I had planned it for my P-40 series over a decade ago) as you can use it to replace a solid opaque recognition/position/navigation light/beacon with a proper clear one. I still buy toothbrushes based on them being in clear colors I can use!
Offer accepted!
I will still do the SBS as not everything is included (like the beacon).
I will still do the SBS as not everything is included (like the beacon).
Heavens Eagle
Well-known member
You are tempting me to get the HK 1/32 A-20 kit. Though Andy is coming out with a 1/16th M3 halftrack and that is something that I had decided I would pick up.
HK doesn't make the B/C kit in 1/32nd scale and good thing they haven't as there are quite a few differences between the B & C! They will release it in 1/48th though.
I have LOADS of data on the halftrack series. So, if you get it and need some TMI, let me know...
This post is repeated on the A-20G-1-DO thread. Some work was done on the engine cowlings for both the A-20B and A-20-G-1-DO as they are the same. This meant adding five (5) exhaust ejector pipes on the outer upper fixed flap (see A-20G-1-DO tech manual image below whose engine cowl cover would the be same), four (4) exhaust ejector pipes on the inner fixed flap, and five more, to complete fourteen (14), underneath the stamp shaped movable flaps on the lower side:
In this photograph, you can see how much I thinned the fixed cowl flaps which should cover the 4 inner and 5 outer exhaust ejectors. I also stated drilling out the formed movable flaps when I noticed something that made me stop. Do you see it? Hint, compare to the images above!
In this photograph, you can see how much I thinned the fixed cowl flaps which should cover the 4 inner and 5 outer exhaust ejectors. I also stated drilling out the formed movable flaps when I noticed something that made me stop. Do you see it? Hint, compare to the images above!
Heavens Eagle
Well-known member
Spacings are different, but that doesn't mean anything as it could be on purpose. Other than that, don't know enough about these to know what is right and what is wrong Saúl.
cowl flaps molded shut?
Indeed, one has six 'bumps' and the other seven. Also asymmetrical. The fixed cowling I thinned show the number of exhaust ejectors I believe are under each...
However, I was WRONG!
This is what is wonderful about our hobby, one learns with every subject, if one wants to and is willing to do the research! Under each fixed cowl should be five on the outer but only three (that is my mistake) on the inner fixed cowl with the remaining six under stamped movable cowls.
Now I need to research which pattern(s) they were. AMT did some very good research on the cockpit, landing gear legs and shape so, were they right here as well? Update, with photo back up, coming but will be posted on the A-20G-1-DO thread to keep it running as it is the same cowl covers.
However, I was WRONG!
This is what is wonderful about our hobby, one learns with every subject, if one wants to and is willing to do the research! Under each fixed cowl should be five on the outer but only three (that is my mistake) on the inner fixed cowl with the remaining six under stamped movable cowls.
Now I need to research which pattern(s) they were. AMT did some very good research on the cockpit, landing gear legs and shape so, were they right here as well? Update, with photo back up, coming but will be posted on the A-20G-1-DO thread to keep it running as it is the same cowl covers.
Heavens Eagle
Well-known member
Cowl covers and what is underneath is something that can come up. The Ju88 I am building and the particular plane (with photos) has the cowl flaps open. I keep finding things that need fixing and opening the cowl flaps is going to be a bit of a chore. Luckily I do have plenty of info to figure out what is underneath and (probably) what is underneath.
You can very well be right! We shall see as I look into it.
@moon puppy mentioned the closed movable cowl covers and I plan them on staying that way! I have enough to do as it is. I simply what the mystery of how the remaining six covered ejector ports appeared.
We see two under the port outer fixed cowl cover (over the five ejector ports) with a pair seen under the starboard nacelle. The kit has, from outer to inner, 2+4:
Two under the fixed cowl on the starboard outer side (which are closer to the top than the port side) and another two under it but... then? Maybe it is 2+2+2? The kit has (from out to inner side) 2+2+3:
'5' seems clearer but '6' I'm not so sure yet...
One of the reasons I DON'T trust restorations is this. Symmetrical 2+4 configuration on the Lewis Air Legends flying example:
To be continued...
Since one would have to route the ejector pipes, that would be a nightmare in its creation. A nod towards asymmetry appears if one reads the technical description literally... five ejectors under the outer fixed cowls, three under the inner fixed cowls, and the remaining six under the formed movable cowls. No mention of their pattern. The only thing known is that it shouldn't be seven formed movable cowls.Is it possible there wasn't much of a standard to the exhaust pipe layout? Wartime field modifications being what they may have been.
Since restorations are usually done from salvaged aircraft, in the case of Lewis Flying Legends it was a Canadian one, they have to 'revert' back so are free to do whatever since they are manufacturing it all.
